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"Explosively formed penetrators" rebranded UK shells, and not Iranian?

Alert reader Phoenixwoman writes:

Looks like that “slam-dunk” evidence that Iran is arming Iraqi insurgents is not so slam-dunk after all. NewsHog has the scoop, here and here.

For one thing, the lettering and numbering isn’t in Farsi (the language used by Iranians); for another, the UK uses 81MM shells, and Iran would be much more likely to use Soviet-style 82MM shells.

In addition: As a commenter at NewsHog noted, the UK uses shells of that type, so there’s a strong likelihood that this was grabbed out of a Brit ammo dump in Iraq, given a cursory rebranding, and then ‘found’ in an insurgents’ den.

Fakes? Say it isn't so!

I've always felt that the lesson the Republicans would have drawn from the WMD fiasco was to actually fake the evidence, instead of just faking the case for war.

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scarshapedstar's picture
Submitted by scarshapedstar on

Last week the Georgia Tech College Republicans put up a bunch of crosses to signify all the womb babies killed by the Feminazis.

For the 83rd consecutive time, they were viciously oppressed by the liberal fascists, and the crosses were stolen. Even though everyone knows that every fucking semester GTCR pulls some kind of stunt, be it an "affirmative action bake sale" or a lawsuit against the school to allow anti-gay messages during orientation and every time some quixotic phantom liberal comes along and knocks their signs or their crosses down. Nobody's ever figured out who this person is, but I sure wish they'd stop, because all they seem to do is give the Republicans a free week to control the Letters To The Editor in the school paper, whining and crying about how they have the utmost respect for free speech and their uncivil opponents don't value debate and the Arena of Ideas and God and Jesus and the Bible.

All told, every semester, it couldn't work out better than if they'd planned it. They're the Joshua Sparling of school clubs.

Hey, wait a minute...

But I still believe
And I will rise up with fists!!

scarshapedstar's picture
Submitted by scarshapedstar on

That was my point. I definitely wouldn't put it past these clowns. If only there were a way to say this with Civility...

But I still believe
And I will rise up with fists!!

We need to pick apart these war on Iran schemes with a fine tooth comb this time. Of course the Internet is hard at work doing that. I even remember reading that there were no Weapons of Mass Destruction in Iraq before that war begane. Hell, I was reading that we were going to war on the Internet back when Bush was still saying that we were not going to war. If we thought invading the sovereign nation of Iraq was the stupidest thing America ever did then you know a war on Iran may just be the nail in our coffin.

Submitted by [Please enter a... (not verified) on

DIO has provided two types of Fuzes required for its Mortar Bombs; AZ111A2 a super quick impact fuze produced to be used for HE Mortar Bombs of 60mm, 81mm and 120mm caliber and M84A1E1, a Pyrotechnic Time Fuze for Illuminating Mortar Bombs.

kelley b's picture
Submitted by kelley b on

In fact, there's a good reason the markings are in English. The factories that made them were built by the British. They're from Pakistan . You know, our ally in the War on Terra [thanks to drobert-bfm].

No Hell below us
Above us, only sky

Submitted by [Please enter a... (not verified) on

Decided to check out just what sort of place "" was just as a preliminary check on their reliability, and instead of a page I get a big red shield with an X on it and the notice:

There is a problem with this website's security certificate.

The security certificate presented by this website was not issued by a trusted certificate authority.

Security certificate problems may indicate an attempt to fool you or intercept any data you send to the server.
We recommend that you close this webpage and do not continue to this website.

Yeah, MS may be a little bit sissified but in this case I think I'm gonna take their advice.


and kellyb, your comment that these Pakistani factories were built by the British caused me to note that the abovementioned "anon" used an interesting spelling on one of his/her words, to whit " DIO has provided two types of Fuzes required for its Mortar Bombs...."

This usage is Brit, innit? Proves nothing, I know but still...interesting.

I got a right nasty virus of Russian origin not long ago and am a little twitchy about visiting websites strange to me. Sorry Anon, maybe you could post the data directly? We are always happy to have technical expertise assist us in our understanding of these matters.

scarshapedstar's picture
Submitted by scarshapedstar on

Well, there's no real harm in going there. The secure connection is because there are sections that only allow military IPs, and you don't want Joe Jihadi to spoof them too easily or be intercepting top-secret dolphin deployment orders or what-have-you. Securing the front page is unnecessary, nothing more...

...or so the Leviathan would have us believe.

But I still believe
And I will rise up with fists!!

Submitted by [Please enter a... (not verified) on

Scarshapedstar, your point is exactly what that warning is intended to get across. the harm is that the page's signature cannot be authenticated. While this is most likely an innocuous error, it can also be caused because Joe Jihadi has already done a successful spoof, and what you think is a legitimate military site is really someone else entirely. The warning is that you may not be talking with who you think you're talking with. That might, indeed, be harmful. Even if you don't share anything too personal, you could get deliberate misinformation and believe it came from a trusted source.

Do not ignore these warnings until/unless you can confirm that no spoofing is going on. Easiest way is to contact the webmaster and ask that they fix the problem (or tell you if there isn't one).

If you look at the picture on the Wikipedia entry on EFPs you'll note that the device shown- typical of those emplaced in Iraq- is not a "shell", mortar round, or warhead, but a simply fashioned mine intended for fixed use. The technology to make these is not cutting edge; like many other devices, once the theory is understood, the execution is simple.

Almost all ordnance produced in the world today is labeled in English. China makes copies of the US Colt .45 that have markings identical to the genuine article, next to the markings for the Chinese factory that makes them.

Which brings us to the pivotal question: What's so difficult to believe about the Iranians sending men and materials into Iraq? They have repeatedly voiced their support of jihadist activities there, and the Shiite militias. Ships have been intercepted carrying materials from Iran to Iraq. I would be far more surprised if Iran didn't support those with similar aims.