Corrente

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Are you 2L4O?

vastleft's picture

Correntewire is the first site to feature shirts with the "2L4O: Too Liberal for Obama" logo.

Below are some ad concepts to appear in the margin at this and (I hope) other blogs. Please vote for your favorite slogan... or suggest new ideas!

A portion of the sale price goes to blogs that help sell the shirts (please contact me at vastleft AT vastleft DOT com if you'd like to promote them on your blog).

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Card-carrying_Buddhist's picture
Submitted by Card-carrying_B... on

Nice work, VastLeft.

I like all of them.

Perhaps I like the "sweetie" one extra best. ; )

BDBlue's picture
Submitted by BDBlue on

And these are brilliant.

madamab's picture
Submitted by madamab on

I definitely want to feature them on my blog. But, the proceeds can go elsewhere. My blogging is just for fun.

I'll email you later.

a little night musing's picture
Submitted by a little night ... on

Except that I may forget to email you later. But, definitely, want to feature on my (Z list) blog!

And all the contributors: Brilliant work, all!

Submitted by Anne on

is this:

I Think, Therefore I Am

2L4O

........................................................

Here's another:

2L4O

Listen To Me Now or Hear Me In November

.........................................................


2L4O

We Won't Be Fooled Again

...........................................................

Memo to Tim Kaine: Real Democrats Are

2L4O

.................................................
This is way more fun that working...

coyotecreek's picture
Submitted by coyotecreek on

I just bought some "plain" ones but will stock up again if any of these captions are used, too!

I love "I think therefore I am...." and Listen to me now or hear me in November"

More. More. More!!

Historiann's picture
Submitted by Historiann on

Anne, I esp. love the "Listen now/Hear me in November" one.

If you are the same Anne who posts at TalkLeft, I always enjoy your comments there. Very on point and smart. (If not, your tee-shirt ideas are still funny!)

Submitted by Anne on

Yes, I am the same Anne who posts at TL - glad you enjoy my (increasingly rant-y) comments - they help keep my head from exploding!

coyotecreek's picture
Submitted by coyotecreek on

Is there inventory ready to ship....I WANT THEM NOW (yes, I'm pretending to be an Obot and throw a tantrum!)

GREAT!

john.halle's picture
Submitted by john.halle on

I appreciate the sentiment, but, speaking for myself, I am not now, nor have I ever been, a "liberal" for reasons enumerated by Adolph Reed here and Chris Hedges here.

Of course, as the bard put it, what's in a name?

Back when I was running for office-as a Green, I would refer to my politics as basically those of the Nixon administration (which started EPA, OSHA, supported a guaranteed annual income, tripled the budget for the NEA etc.)

If that's conservatism, I'm fine with that.

And if liberalism is spending trillions of dollars to bomb wedding parties in Afghanistan (not to mention, a generation before, making Southeast Asia a lunar landscape), that's a show I won't buy a ticket for.

john.halle's picture
Submitted by john.halle on

OK. How about a liberal is someone who objects to a country which is engaged in massive human rights violations and war crimes being the leading recipient of U.S. military aid.

Are you a liberal?

john.halle's picture
Submitted by john.halle on

See here.

Noted PEPs. Mark Green, Michael Lerner, Henry Waxman, David Sirota (former AIPAC staffer), Anthony Weiner, Jerold Nadler etc.

vastleft's picture
Submitted by vastleft on

you think rote support of Israel is a hallmark of liberalism. I guess in Lewis Carroll fashion, words can mean whatever you want them to.

madamab's picture
Submitted by madamab on

And John, why are the Palestinians still in those camps? Is it All Israel's Fault? Or is the blame shared by the Palestinian leaders, who do nothing to help them, and the surrounding Arab countries, who continue to refuse to take them in?

Is there any room for nuance in your view of the Middle Eastern situation? Or are you a typical Green who thinks Israel has no right to exist and the Palestinians are 100% right?

By the way, I find very few liberals who support Israel at all, much less blindly. It's one of the things I hate about being a liberal.

john.halle's picture
Submitted by john.halle on

I'm going to take this opportunity not to respond to either of these arguments trusting that those with minimal critical faculties will recognize their transparent straw man characteristics and near total empirical bankruptcy.

I'm not doing so to make a broader point which is that developing a movement is all about forming coalitions and often these coalitions are with those whose views one finds to a greater or lesser degree appalling-in this case, those who defend and continue to support the financing of gross human rights abuses, state sanctioned terrorism and, as the Goldstone Report has copiously documented, numerous war crimes.

If on the off chance corrente develops to become a venue where real political organizing takes place, as opposed to merely blowing off steam some of us will have to swallow hard to work with these sorts of folks.

I am perfectly willing to do so-to the extent that I might even buy a couple of the T-shirts, which are really quite well done and more than a little clever to boot.

We need more of that kind of thing-which is not to say I would be caught dead wearing one. (For reasons discussed above.)

What I do rather like is my "I'd rather be smashing imperialism" bumpersticker.

But as someone once suggested, let's let a thousand flowers bloom.

vastleft's picture
Submitted by vastleft on

... is your conflation of "liberal" with "blind Israel supporter."

It's unsupported even by your citation of "PEP," which defines a subset of "progressives" (increasingly seen as a weak-tea version of "liberal"), those who lean against a presumed norm on the left.

madamab's picture
Submitted by madamab on

sounds like you responded to me.

The response was 1) You're lying, 2) You're stupid, and 3) You're a horrible person.

What a wonderful conversation we're having. Think I'll disengage while I can still hold the expletives in.

john.halle's picture
Submitted by john.halle on

That is exactly how I would characterize your views on this matter-as you would mine.

But-here is the crucial point: I am quite willing to work with those, including yourself, whose views on a particular matter I find utterly reprehensible so long as there is sufficient common ground elsewhere.

Furthermore, I would suggest that our failure to do more generally, so has a lot to do with where we find ourselves now, which is nowhere as a political force.

That is the broader and far more important issue being discussed here.

madamab's picture
Submitted by madamab on

No, you see, that's the difference between you and me.

I don't think people who disagree with me are lying, stupid, horrible people, unless they are people in power like Bush or Obama.

I think they...disagree with me.

Gasp.

I would suggest that the reason we don't do more as a political force is because of people like you, who think that anyone who disagrees with them is lying, stupid and horrible.

john.halle's picture
Submitted by john.halle on

Again, a failure to read. I don't make judgements on personalities but on their positions.

I am not characterizing you, but your views on this matter as you have described them. A very different thing.

Might I suggest that we not derail this thread any further with this discussion.

I will now buy a t-shirt (which I will never wear) from someone whose views ON THIS MATTER I find reprehensible.

john.halle's picture
Submitted by john.halle on

As you will see from consulting the above, I have done nothing of the kind, nor have I referred to anyone as a "blind supporter of Israel" which you, in a stunning display of intellectual dishonesty, attribute to me as a quotation

That said, I am willing to enter into coalitions with all sorts of rogues, including those who are incapable of reading.

Great T shirts.

a little night musing's picture
Submitted by a little night ... on

(addressing john.halle)

Here you said:

How about a liberal is someone who objects to a country which is engaged in massive human rights violations and war crimes being the leading recipient of U.S. military aid.

Which sounds a lot to me as if you think liberals should believe that Israel has no right to exist. (Which is why I initially did not want to get involved here, because this kind of discussion generally goes nowhere, but I wanted to point out that Madamab and vastleft are not responding to a "straw man" but to something you actually said, or implied.)

And here you said:

in this case, those who defend and continue to support the financing of gross human rights abuses, state sanctioned terrorism and, as the Goldstone Report has copiously documented, numerous war crimes.

Where, exactly, have you seen this done at Corrente? Where is this coming from?

Putting these two together reinforces the impression that you're saying that "liberals" are bad because they are blind supporters of Israel. (Can you not understand that it's possible to support the existence of the state of Israel without necessarily supporting everything that state does?)

I take your larger point that forming coalitions means often having to work with people whose political opinions do not always coincide in every respect with your own, and who may hold some opinions you find repellant. (Generic "you"' not you, john.halle, in particular.) What I'm not understanding is why you're jumping on this particular issue at this particular thread, and I'm curious.

And, by the way, I do have to take exception to your characterization of Corrente:

If on the off chance corrente develops to become a venue where real political organizing takes place, as opposed to merely blowing off steam

A lot more goes on here than just "blowing off steam". We have pointed people to actions they can do; we have provided our own political analyses; we went through HR3200 virtually line by line trying to understand what was in the bill (and we did in online for all to see and join in); and, for heaven's sake, we have shared gardening tips. Not that there's anything wrong with blowing off steam, but if that's all you see here then I suggest there's a little confirmation bias going on.

Oh, and BTW vastleft: love the T-shirts!

[But maybe we want to lose the "teabag" one? Or rephrase? I'm not so fond of using or reminding people of the "teabagger" label.]

vastleft's picture
Submitted by vastleft on

I'm strongly opposed to using racy "teabagging" and "teabagger" associations as glib putdowns of right-leaning populists, but if I understand correctly, "teabags" are the chosen prop for the tea party protests.

Historiann's picture
Submitted by Historiann on

Well, I agree anyway.

I love these ideas VL. I like your "well, who isn't?" shirt best.

How about

2L4O: Happiness is not a warm pony

Not sure that means exactly what I want it to mean--maybe someone else can make it funnier/more interesting.

Submitted by Anne on

Am imagining a parenthetical with it:

(and don't forget to take the crap with you)

Historiann's picture
Submitted by Historiann on

But you beat me to it, Anne. Damn, you're smart!

Nothing like a runaway pony and having to muck out the stall, anyway. (Maybe Hillary or Martha Coakley or some other discarded woman can clean up for him?)

vastleft's picture
Submitted by vastleft on

The only shirt so far is the "2L4O" shirt.

The other tag lines are ad slogans to encourage people to click into the shirt site.

One of the trade-offs of doing real silk-screened shirts instead of low-quality/high-priced Cafepress demand printing is that I have to carry inventory or do slow/expensive one-offs or super-small batches (which the vendor isn't too fond of doing). That will reduce the number of variants, but if there appears to be especially good demand on one or other slogan shirts, they could be in our future.

In any case, all the ideas are most welcome at least for promotional purposes and maybe for turning into wearables down the line.

Submitted by lambert on

I'm gonna get a pony LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!

My pony's on back-order.

Here come the warm ponies!

vastleft's picture
Submitted by vastleft on

"Maybe she will do a bit of spying
With microcameras hidden in her hair"

john.halle's picture
Submitted by john.halle on

To be clear, nowhere have I stated that "Israel" or for that matter any other state, has or does not have the right to exist.

What I have said is exactly what the quotation says, namely that states which are engaged in massive human rights violations and war crimes (as is now virtually undisputed) should not be receiving U.S. military aid.

It would seem to me that those identifying as liberals (not to mention anyone with a commitment to minimal decency) should accept this proposition as a virtual truism.

But here is the disconnect:

When it comes to the general proposition, liberals are likely to accept it as more or less foundational. But when it comes to the specific instance, namely the behavior of a favored state, many (though by no means all) liberals find all sorts of reasons for why it is not applicable; I'm sure you are more than familiar with these so I won't go through the litany.

Hence the familiar charge of liberal hypocrisy-one which is relevant to this and numerous other instances some of which are documented in the Reed and Hedges articles linked to above, not to mention the Phil Ochs song which stands the test of time.

So to reiterate, I'm perfectly willing to work with liberals. But given the last half century of the history of liberalism, their endless capitulations to power, their willingness to wink at atrocities when they are committed by their own side, not to mention their disgraceful cheerleading for liberated markets going under the name of "neoliberalism" it is not a category which I am comfortable associating myself with.

Finally, some might say that the McNamaras, Bundys, Johnsons, Kennedys, Carters, Clintons of the past weren't "real" liberals.

Real liberals, according to them, would, for example, never offer apologetics and support for state sanctioned violence and de facto genocide. The numerous liberals who do precisely that, on this list and elsewhere when it comes to Israel-Palestine demonstrates quite clearly that this long and shabby tradition remains very much in force.

vastleft's picture
Submitted by vastleft on

You felt it was relevant to introduce a purity test about I/P here.

Then, you add:

"if liberalism is spending trillions of dollars to bomb wedding parties in Afghanistan (not to mention, a generation before, making Southeast Asia a lunar landscape), that's a show I won't buy a ticket for."

Since liberals, collectively, are the one political stripe that is willing -- sometimes much more than willing -- to dignify the "P" side of I/P issues and criticize the "I" side, it just seems kind of odd to me to take this tack vis-a-vis a slogan that promotes left-side criticism of Obama.

DCblogger's picture
Submitted by DCblogger on

sounds like a web site
except it ain't
luv the designs

a little night musing's picture
Submitted by a little night ... on

Somebody want to claim it? How much does that cost?
(Yes, I'm very ignorant and have to run so no time to google)

illusionofjoy's picture
Submitted by illusionofjoy on

A simple website costs on average $10/year for a registered domain name (if not already claimed by another party who will likely inflate the price before giving it up) and as little as $5-20/month for server space, depending on how much storage and how many add-ons one wishes to purchase from his or her webhost.

These charges assume one codes the web pages on his or her own.

illusionofjoy's picture
Submitted by illusionofjoy on

2l4o.com

Registrant:
Domains by Proxy, Inc.

Registered through: GoDaddy.com, Inc. (http://www.godaddy.com)
Domain Name: 2L4O.COM

Domain servers in listed order:
NS31.DOMAINCONTROL.COM
NS32.DOMAINCONTROL.COM

2l40.net
2l4o.org

No results

vastleft's picture
Submitted by vastleft on

I also have 2L40.com (with a zero), in case people mistype.

Is anyone having trouble reaching the site by browsing there???

Aeryl's picture
Submitted by Aeryl on

Links talking about it, but nothing directly to the site.

Card Carrying Buddhist is promoting them, though perhaps not officially. You may want to contact her.

Aeryl's picture
Submitted by Aeryl on

If i put it in the Google toolbar, and click search, it takes me straight to the site, probably b/c it's Blogger, but there you go.

I'll also be ordering one, maybe more.

vastleft's picture
Submitted by vastleft on

I just switched the settings in Blogger so the site will be seen by search engines, and I'll check in with CCB/NBFH to see if she wants to participate in the ongoing promotion.

Card-carrying_Buddhist's picture
Submitted by Card-carrying_B... on

conceptually officially promoting them, but she is html-challenged, and must work on figuring out what to do.

(And your site definitely works, since that's where I picked up the info that I posted. )

gqmartinez's picture
Submitted by gqmartinez on

and I'll buy one when I gets paid...

I wouldn't be fond of adding extra lines for the shirts. I think the 2L4O is sufficient as it is.

Valley Girl's picture
Submitted by Valley Girl on

I gotta say though, just as a side note, that for me "too left/lefty for Obama" would more correctly reflect my own label. *g* I don't identify myself as a "liberal". I'm a lefty, gdi.

vastleft's picture
Submitted by vastleft on

Sorry if I haven't replied to you individually, but this is a really gratifying response, and I'm reading and re-reading all the suggestions.

Who knows where all this is leading, but it does seem that this week a lot of people are taking notice of Obama's left-side critics as never before.

Submitted by Anne on

But...I really liked cg.eye's suggestion of:

Listen To Me Now Or Fear Me In November

Which gets even better if it's:

Hear Me Now Or Fear Me In November

It's a little shorter and the "hear-fear" thing has more punch.

vastleft's picture
Submitted by vastleft on

Yours really hit the spot because:

* It better matches the Hans and Franz "Hear me now, and believe me later."
* We have enough fear merchants in our lives as it is
* Though the context is November (and thank heavens not in June!), "fear me" might suggest to some an unwholesome sort of consequence

Note: your "hear me / fear me" construction has a good ring to it, but I'm concerned about being in the "fear" biz. That said, somehow as a rhyme (as Johnny Cochrane could tell you), it seems to magically make more sense.

Others, am I overly fretting over the f-word here, especially with how nicely it plays in Anne's nifty riff on cg.eye's riff on her riff? ("Hear Me Now or Fear Me In November")

Aeryl's picture
Submitted by Aeryl on

Fear as a tool for oppression, only works one way, from those with power, towards those with no power.

Here, those of us with no power, are warning those with power that they should fear us, which isn't fear mongering. It's a justified response to egregious abuses by those in power.

Submitted by Anne on

appropriate to convey the anger that many of us feel at being marginalized and ignored because the Democratic Party's peripheral vision no longer includes anything left of center; I guess I would liken it to the "I am Woman, Hear Me Roar" mantra, which arose out of our anger at feeling like no one was hearing us.

Maybe HEED Me Now or Hear Me In November is both shorter/punchier AND conveys the message?

One of my issues with the party is that it has been taken over by people who think we're going to get what we want by playing nice and minding our manners; I'm a little tired of politely clearing my throat and waiting to be acknowledged, I guess!

vastleft's picture
Submitted by vastleft on

I think the hear/fear rhyme has the magic, and somehow the power of rhyme seems to make it less suggestive of the wrong kind of fear. I'm warming to it.

Subliminally, I was already thinking of the Helen Reddy song. Could it be a faded rose from days gone by? Oops, wrong Helen Reddy song.

Submitted by lambert on

Han and Franz are ironic. Let's keep this irony free.

I could even see something like "FEAR" in flames, or with torches and pitchforks behind it.

Submitted by Anne on

I have another idea. It came to me when I was reading about the new commission being formed to do an end run around every fail-safe in order to cut and gut the entitlement programs.

Red T-Shirts.

What would they say?

2L4O

Seeing Red Now? Wait Til November

Picks up on the "seeing red" of being just so, so angry at so much the Dems are and are not doing, and, it alludes to the consequences of failing to wake up - a tidal wave of Red as Republicans win big in November.

Just a thought.

vastleft's picture
Submitted by vastleft on

... does make me wonder about the decision to go with high-quality printing. As it stands, I'll keep stockpiling the great suggestions and will have to pick my shots as to when to introduce new/variant products, since it's a considerably bigger undertaking than with the demand-print sites like Cafepress.

So, please keep the ideas coming, and do forgive me if I'm slow to jump on some really good ones.

Submitted by cg.eye on

It displaces the implied threat of "fear/anger" from the wearer to the reader -- they should fear *you*, Dear Reader, once you start seeing red about the economy, our wars, the general corruption, etc.

*And* it leaves the choice to reader to Do Something: Either get angry now, for the things you believe in, or let the Republicans use the general anger out there to win.

Would one red t-shirt cost more than the black ones?

vastleft's picture
Submitted by vastleft on

are just ad copy at this point. If we see strong support for a particular slogan, such as hear/fear, I'll get some made up.

In your (and everyone's) opinions, would the added slogans work OK in the same print color (i.e., white for now), or is the second color as in red text the ad graphics essential?

And while we're at it... what second shirt color would be most popular? Red? White? Blue? Something else?

caseyOR's picture
Submitted by caseyOR on

construction. It has a nice rhythm. And let's face it, fear is just about the only motivator we have left to us. I want my senators and my congressman to fear me and their other constituents. I want all three of them to be in a constant state of worry about retaining their political offices. Asking nicely for them to act like Democrats didn't work; asking a little less nicely, but still really kind of nice, hasn't worked. So, I am totally down with the "do what I want or you're out of a job" approach.

Hear me now or fear me in November.